| Posted by Angellica, 11-21-2011, 03:58 PM | | Hi all, I have been thinking about starting my own Web Hosting business and the research I have done over the past week has me a bit overwhelmed, to say the least. However, I narrowed my extensive search down (with the recommendations of this forum) to a few hosts that I actually liked what they were offering but have a few questions.
The Resellers I've researched and feel comfortable with so far are Turnkey, Innohosting and HostGator.
The costs that each one lists on their plans seem to be close enough not to complain about, but the space and bandwidth differs a good deal on some. For instance, Turnkey and Innohosting. I guess I don't get why Turnkey can offer so much for nearly the same price as Inno. Can anyone explain this more to me? How is it possible for there to be that much of a difference in each others offered space and bandwidth reseller packages when the cost of each package is fairly close?
My second question is about End User Support. This is a MUST for me since I will be a totally new Reseller with no experience and could greatly use this service. I'm thinking this is where HostGator will be eliminated from my choices, since I can not see that they even offer this to their resellers. Anyway, is it safe to assume that the End User Support would be similar with the Hosts that do offer it? Is there anything else I need to know about this service?
3. More than anything else, I'm looking for reseller SUPPORT. Since I have absolutely no experience what-so-ever in reselling, I'm very much needing a host that will be there every step of the way in helping me get everything set up so that I can open shop asap. I know I will have tons of questions, even on the most simplest matter, and I'm not the type of person that wants to constantly have to ask questions for every single little thing, so if anyone knows if these companies offers guides for start up resellers, that would help a lot as well.
You are most welcome to also suggest any other hosting company I may have overlooked, that fits what I am looking for, and thanks in advance to anyone that can help with my questions/concerns.
Last edited by Angellica; 11-21-2011 at 04:02 PM.
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| Posted by rv_irl, 11-21-2011, 04:31 PM | | Hi Angellica,
Great to hear you're considering InnoHosting as one of your potential web hosts!
In regards to your question concerning the differences in space/bandwidth. This all really boils down to the approach each host takes. While I cannot comment on your other two respected hosts, I can comment on our approach. With us, our emphasis is on reliability & support. I believe those are two most important things when it comes to choosing a web host and maintaining a high level of both isn't cheap to provide. So to make we maintain a particular level of service, we set realistic usage limits relative to the price. We prefer servers to be lightly loaded rather than pack as many customers as we can onto one server, to ensure that dynamic sites utilising the likes of php/mysql work fast & reliably.. This balance between limit & price has proved to be a very reliable method that our customers are happy with.
I wouldn't say. The way we deliver end user support is completely different to other web hosts that I'm aware of. With us we developed our end user system in house. We had long offered end user support prior to that and so used that experience to create a product which addresses the typical concerns and issues related to outsourcing your support to your upstream provider. As such, the software is exclusive to us, the method of delivery, quality, personalisation etc. will not be the same as other companies (whether it's better or not, that's for the user to decide).
So all in all, each host is going to be different in the way they do things. Each will have different prices, each will have different goals and targets. I think your best move would be to see which one matches your requirements the most, which one you like the most. This is of course assuming you'd be happy ending up with any of the hosts you've researched.
Hope that helps!
Last edited by rv_irl; 11-21-2011 at 04:36 PM.
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| Posted by sameev29, 11-21-2011, 04:36 PM | | As you will need end user support mostly you should look between Inno hosting and turnkeyinternet.About the more disk space and bandwidth provided by turnkeyinternet,I am also looking at this and want to be sure about this.I mean it impossible to provide that much disk space and bandwidth for that little price.
So,take a little more time and find out more about these matters.
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| Posted by availes, 11-21-2011, 04:50 PM | | I would also recommend doing a search on this forum for reviews on the hosts you are considering. Also you should submit some questions to the hosts you are considering to get an idea about how fast they respond and how helpful they are with their responses.
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| Posted by kpmedia, 11-21-2011, 06:37 PM | | If you don't want to support your own users, and don't understand hosting, I have to wonder why you even want to enter the field as a reseller. Hosts that offer such a service are really just shooting themselves in the foot, providing support for a fraction of the cost it would normally net them.
I just don't get it.
Hosting isn't an easy-money turnkey operation.
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| Posted by Forward Web, 11-21-2011, 06:53 PM | | I have to agree with this statement, unfortunatley there are many hosts out there that promote reseller web hosting as an easy way to make money (which those of us with even a fraction of experience know its not the case).
With that beings @ OP, there is nothing wrong with your approach (initially). However most importantly, have you thought about the time of market you are going to target? In otherwords, how do you plan to get your first customers? I think you will find that you will have an easier time gaining/retaining customers if you are providing support directly to your clients (it will also force you to learn more about the services you are providing).
Just my two cents
PS. I wouldn't worry so much about the diskspace/bandwidth if you are just getting started. Just look for a company that you feel comfortable working with and most importantly, a company that is known to provide a solid/stable service. If you play your cards right, your customers wont be contacting you all that much anyway.
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| Posted by Angellica, 11-21-2011, 07:19 PM | | I find your comment a bit rude and you assume you know what my intentions are, but I will answer anyway. I did not ever say that I 'did not want to support my own users', I stated that since I am new to all of this that End User Support would be a must for now. Did you even bother to ask me what my long term plans and intentions were? No, you did not, and I didn't think I had to write a novel to explain all that I am planning for a future business when I only needed one simple question answered.
So, to keep this short, yes I will need all the help I can get in the beginning. Do I plan on letting my host do all my dirty work while I sit back and reap the rewards? No, I certainly do not. I very much intend on getting right in the middle of any and all customer support issues when I am schooled enough and confident enough in doing so.
By the way, I never assumed reselling would be an easy-money turnkey operation either, but it is something that I have been wanting to do for some time now, and it is something that will very much go hand in hand with another business of mine.
Now that I feel like I have answered all of your concerns, maybe you could answer one of mine? Were you born reselling? I'm sure you knew absolutely nothing when the idea first appeared to you. You had to start somewhere, right? I mean, assuming YOU are a reseller yourself. If not, then I'm lost as to why you decided to pipe in and try to tear my plans apart.
I just don't get it.
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| Posted by Angellica, 11-21-2011, 07:22 PM | | And to everyone else that posted back with helpful insight and information, I thank you very much.
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| Posted by sameev29, 11-21-2011, 07:24 PM | | Don't listen to all these if you have been wanting to do this for sometime than take a reseller package,do some hard work and make some profit.It won't be easy as I have said but don't loose faith.
Best of luck.
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| Posted by kpmedia, 11-21-2011, 07:51 PM | | As a warning.
You learn something before you start doing it. You don't learn as you go, when it involves the work of customers. That's like getting legal advice from a law student, or practicing medicine before getting licensed. Learn first, go into business second.
particular elements with the web hosting industry have decided to expand their business by essentially lying to people, insisting that "anybody can do it". Well, no, it doesn't happen quite like that. Thousands of crappy reviews on WHT prove just that. We even have a name for failing hosts: the deadpool. Most of them are just resellers that have no idea what they're doing.
So again, as a warning -- as a reality check. You're free to ignore it, or re-think your entire business plan. Take a tip from those of us who have been hosting customers for more than a decade: If you lack knowledge on the products you're selling, you'll be discovered quickly.
If you have more knowledge than you've let on, then the warning doesn't necessarily apply 100%.
Don't confuse honesty with rudeness.
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| Posted by PowerBox16, 11-21-2011, 11:46 PM | | kpmedia i do agree with you but you seem to use words to harshly
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| Posted by PowerBox16, 11-22-2011, 12:05 AM | | op you can go with the following host (User End Support)
InnoHosting
EZPZHosting(a tittle expensive compared to others (that is my POV)
thats all i know.
do note that you will drop your specs if you go with Host that provides support for your clients
if you go with no user support
your specs will be alot higher and allows you to sell more space,bandwidth
Here are some good host that dosent provide support for your clients
Do note if you go with end support your specs will drop and you will not be able to sell alot of space which makes it harder to sell
Both are good host (even myself idk which to choose)
Elven2.com (100GB Diskspace, 1000gb bandwidth,free 1 Dedicated ip+ free whmcs or clientexe billing system, free domain reseller account)
JaguarPC.ocm (50GB Diskspace Unlimited bandwidth ,Free 3 Dedicated ip + Free whmcs billing system ,free domain reseller account)
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| Posted by Angellica, 11-22-2011, 03:02 AM | | Wow, what do you think the whole point of my posting questions was for? :/
I am learning, I never denied that, I fully admitted to it. Tell you what. You point me to a Re-sellers School or a class I can take to learn more and I will gladly sign up. Other than that, I have no choice but to do what I've been doing for the past 6+ months, and that is to study, read, ask questions to experts and learn as much as I possibly can on every aspect of reselling. I don't know what else you're suggesting I do.
And for the record, I never said I was going to immediately sign up for a reseller plan, install everything needed to get it going and then go out the very next day and find customers to sign up. After it's all set up, I still plan to continue to study and learn. I want to be good at what I do. No, I MUST be good at what I do or I simply will not do it at all.
Thanks for your time and your concerns, but I do plan to move on with this, with or without your help.
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| Posted by Angellica, 11-22-2011, 03:13 AM | | I understand what you're saying, but in all honesty, I'm not all that concerned about big fancy specs in my beginning stages. Once I get everything set up and running for a couple years, I will most likely start looking at better packages and hosts, but for now, I'm really most concerned with a reseller that will be there when I need them and when my customers need them.
I'm actually looking forward to support issues with my future customers, I feel I will be able to learn much about that as well by helping them the best I can, and knowing that if I can not, that my reseller will be right there behind me to get the issues resolved.
When Innohosting came in to reply to this post, that told me a lot about them right there. They did not have to take the time to help answer any questions of mine, but they did, and they earned a great deal of respect from me and most likely will be my final choice.
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| Posted by HostXNow_Chris, 11-22-2011, 08:50 AM | | I kind of agree to this.
Before I started HostXNow I had already been working with websites since 2005, 2008 I started a Website Design Manager course with SkillsTrain http://www.skillstrainuk.com/web-des...-syllabus.html. I received the completion certificate this month as it goes. I still need to do the revision and do the exams. Anyway, through 2009 till now I learned a lot at WebHostingTalk. 9/10 the issue has already been resolved and can be found using Google/WebHostingTalk. Failing that you can always ask your own host or hire a system administrator.
If you did that you'd be waiting for ever to startup. You're always learning. You'll never know everything.
As long as you get most of the basics down (some don't even know how to use cPanel properly) you should be ok. You'll learn a lot of things through the good old' trial and error.
As for the storage and transfer vs price, some hosts just oversell more than others (even extreme overselling with a lot of the bigger established hosting providers or fly-by-night/kiddie hosts who don't know any better).
For best performance and uptime you need to look for packages with realistic storage/transfer quotas for realistic costs. Uptime/performance is far more important than storage/transfer quotas and support (if you know how to WHT/Google issues).
But I don't think you should rely on end user support 100%, especially when starting up and getting new customers.
It'd be best if you asked your Reseller the question and then reply to your customer (reword response if needed) for a more personal response.
You can also get this book http://www.webhostingbusinessbook.com
Good luck!
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| Posted by DWS2006, 11-22-2011, 09:21 AM | | I disagree, I think End-User support is a great feature that allows inexperienced resellers the opportunity to learn the hosting business as they grow. End-User support also helps a reseller provide faster, higher quality support since the support techs answering tickets have the access to actually fix issues.
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| Posted by sameev29, 11-22-2011, 04:39 PM | | You are absolutely right.
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| Posted by Hivelocity-Lee, 11-22-2011, 04:58 PM | | If you are looking to be a Dedicated Reseller I would definitely look for the host with the best Support, and even consider purchasing a Managed Support Package(managed services) along with your plan that you signup for. So my point is that the lowest pricing when looking for a host isn't the most important thing. In your situation I would be looking for the best support so that when you do have an issue you aren't hung out to dry. Basically looking at a managed hosting service on top of the plan you choose would be very smart thing to do. Most host advertise good support but you will find if you have needs outside of their realm of support you will get charged a hefty hourly rate. Purchasing managed services would offset these charges. That being said the managed package you purchase would determine the amount of support you get outside of the realm of free support they offer.
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| Posted by kpmedia, 11-22-2011, 06:31 PM | | True, true.
But it should go down like this...
Okay, so I want to go into business. What do I need to know?
- How to R ... check
- How to Q ... check
- How to X ... check
- How to Y ... check
- How to Z ... check
Not:
- How to R ... check
- How to Q ... I'll just ask for help on a forum!
- How to X ... eh, looks easy, I'll figure it out as I go!
- How to Y ... hmm, not quite sure, I'll learn it eventually!
- How to Z ... no idea, but can't be that hard!
Because even after you check everything you think you need to know, there's a bunch of things you'll learn about later, which you may or may not know. Anybody that's run a business can list out their "oh crap" moments when realizing they'd poorly planned in some area.
Hosting is a highly technical service. That some hosts want to offer training wheels and crutches to help newbies sounds nice, but long-term it's just not a sustainable business arrangement for either party. In many ways, the whole reseller market sounds like late-night infomercials promising methods to unlimited riches. There's a reason many hosting customers do their best to avoid resellers.
Again, just some friendly advice.
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| Posted by Hivelocity-Lee, 11-22-2011, 06:43 PM | | I would have to agree and well put, but the hosting company I work for actually encourages resellers and that is due to the way we have our reseller program setup. I am referring to a dedicated reseller solution though. As far as I can tell this case is for a legacy reseller? I assume. At any rate we always make sure that our customers get their initial setup going and also our support department goes above and beyond the call throughout the life of their account with my company.
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| Posted by kpmedia, 11-22-2011, 07:22 PM | | I'd say that Hivelocity isn't really a "hosting" reseller but rather a "server" reseller. Without writing a long response -- yes, applies to legacy reseller.
What doesn't make any sense is something like this:
- Reseller plan has 100 accounts for $20, and gives end-user support.
- Normal plan is $5 month, and gives end-user support.
- So $20 vs. $500 for the same amount of work?
- A host takes a 95% cut in pay, but still offers the same QoS for support?
- Sorry, but I just have to call BS. That's a faulty unsustainable business model.
- And this is ignoring "unlimited" reseller models.
It would make sense if there were a per-ticket fee, optional managed/support cost of $250+, etc. Nothing is free. And when it is, it's usually not very good.
--
Another big issue of not knowing enough is that the upstream can lie to you -- and get away with it. So learning what's what is also a bit of a security for your own well-being. Big hosts like Godaddy hire a lot of techs, and a lot of them are as dumb as a box of rocks.
If you "learn as you go", then you might be learning myths, bad methods/habits, etc. That's true of most fields.
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| Posted by foobic, 11-22-2011, 09:18 PM | | You'd need to be a provider offering these reseller plans to know for sure, but my guess is that the numbers work out quite differently. eg.
Average << 100 user accounts per reseller accountMany / most resellers still doing much / most of their own end-user support and just using the provider for out-of-hours or holiday backup.
In which case I can see it being a sustainable business model. A few resellers probably get far more support than they pay for at the expense of the majority, who buy more than they really need for the reassurance that it's there if they need it. IOW a typical overselling model - very common and often successful, provided it's well managed.
TBH, I really see no point in end-user support except as backup. Why would anyone attempting to become a host not do their own end-user support?
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| Posted by DWS2006, 11-22-2011, 09:46 PM | | For a faulty unsustainable business model HostGator, HawkHost, Jaguar PC, TurnKey, etc. have made this work very well for a long period of time.
The biggest "myth" above is that end-user support is somehow substantially increasing the support load of the reseller provider. However, 95% or more of the end-user support tickets will be opened even without end-user support. A reseller hosting customer without end-user support will simply relay issues to their provider.
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| Posted by DWS2006, 11-22-2011, 09:50 PM | | Again, I don't get this logic when discussing reseller hosting. A reseller has no direct access to the server and can not correct any technical issues on their own. Even installing a php mod is out of reach.
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| Posted by foobic, 11-22-2011, 10:54 PM | | We're talking about providers who offer reseller plans with end-user support. I guess it depends on your user-base but for me the vast majority of end-user tickets can be resolved without root access - they're simply "Can you reset my password for..." "How do I do this..." etc.
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| Posted by kpmedia, 11-23-2011, 01:02 AM | | That's been my underlying concern with the entire business model. It appeals to people who want to get rich by basically doing nothing. It reads like an infomercial at 3 a.m. None of the numbers make any sense. I do agree that the numbers are fungible, and that actual figures could vary, but it's still an extreme discount with promise of the same support quality.
Hivelocity made a good comparison to their own reseller method, which appears to offer support packages for an added fee -- that makes more sense, as a pay-for-play type model. If you want to take a vacation, for example, grab a month of outsourced (in-house at host) support and take time off.
That's always my observation, too. Your average question exists somewhere between newbie-level and asinine, and doesn't involve any sort of root access. Even moderate issues can be handled from WHM, if not from cPanel itself.
---
I'm not anti-reseller. It's a great product for small businesses, especially ones that need to offer hosting for site-owning clients. I've long used reseller hosting for that reason. It allows the client independent control panel access for simple tasks, should they need to self-managed beyond the CMS editor.
What I question is the person who wants to be a "host" while also not actually being a host. Just pay $20, do nothing technical, and rake in profits? Those are generally deadpool candidates, not the next HostGator story (couple of guys in a dorm room).
I've met quite a few great hosts at WHT, from large to small, young owners to old ones. The consistent theme for the successful ones is that this isn't treated like a scheme or ploy to make money on the side. It's a major investment of time and finances.
If you want to be a host -- then actually be a host.
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| Posted by DWS2006, 11-23-2011, 09:58 AM | | It really is an issue of the needs of a certain client base. A group of a 100 typical shared clients won't generate many support tickets on average. If a group that small is generating tickets at a high volume there is likely some instability within the hosting platform itself. Being sure to encourage the use of a knowledge base or other self-support options limits low priority tickets over time.
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| Posted by HostXNow_Chris, 11-23-2011, 10:23 AM | | Not even 1% use our End User Support. Now that is probably because the price/quotas for our Shared hosting packages are realistic, and so we only attract those that know what realistic price vs storage/transfer quotas are and already know most of the day-to-day basics of running websites.
Offering End User Support is like including a WHMCS license with your Reseller package, not everyone will use the WHMCS license = not many will need support. And there is more profit for the host.
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