| Posted by okok, 06-18-2004, 03:40 PM | | I am going to get a reseller account as a solution for hosting several websites I administer. I am not going to offer hosting to others. As I have never used this kind of account before I am not sure what "Overselling permitted" in the hosting company's terms mean. Is it good or bad?
Thanks
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| Posted by AMD72, 06-18-2004, 03:45 PM | | The term overselling refers to offering for sale more than what your resources actually are, the idea being that your customers will not actually use everything you offer. It's a business tactic that can work, but you have to be very careful with it. As far as your situation goes, you are not reselling to anyone else, so as long as you don't go over what your account limits are, you should be fine. My only concern would be sharing a server with too many other sites because of the overselling that others on the same server will probably be doing.
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| Posted by twastudios, 06-18-2004, 03:49 PM | | Typically "overselling" is bad and is referred to as a "no no" when operating a host.
If your potential hoster allows that and mentions so in their TOS, you could be in for a bumpy ride as their servers could be potentially be loaded down, slow and/or offline a lot.
Cheers.
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| Posted by okok, 06-18-2004, 03:55 PM | | Thank you for your answer.
Is it common for hosting companies to permit reselling in their reseller accounts? Do they take measures to insure overselling does not become risky? In other words, do such companies usually set clear limits to overselling in advance, or just monitor the actual use to make sure their actual resources are not exhausted?
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| Posted by twastudios, 06-18-2004, 04:04 PM | | Yes, that is what reselling means. I give you an account of 500mbs, and you resell that account in 100mb chunks, giving you 5 customers of your own.
The systems monitor the bandwidth and disk space, just like a regular account, so hosts can monitor what's being used and how much of it. These "limits" are usually determined by a "reseller package" as outlined upfront during the sale.
Depending upon how profitable a reseller some hosts look past it and continue to let them due business as they are making money.
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| Posted by BuyMyCompany, 06-18-2004, 05:15 PM | | Overselling is a great tool!
Most people use 20 - 30% of what they sign up for.
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| Posted by twastudios, 06-18-2004, 05:25 PM | | It is a risky thing to do anyway, and is not looked upon very highly even if they do only use 30% of their max.
Cheers
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| Posted by BuyMyCompany, 06-18-2004, 05:31 PM | | I realize that, but it's a nice tool for a reseller, when they only have 5GB of space, and want to be able to sell services for sites with 5GB of space.
They can already have 5 sites sold at 500MB each, and still be able to signup an account for 5GB. Then they can expand their disk space from THEIR host if they need to.
That's all made possible through overselling. Therefore, it's a great tool.
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| Posted by twastudios, 06-18-2004, 05:37 PM | | That is not overselling, that is planned expansion. If you know you can increase your bandwidth and space, then you can continue to sell larger amounts and purchase larger amounts.
Overselling would be selling the 5 100mb accounts, and then selling another 5 100Mb accounts without the intention of purchasing additional services to support those clients in hopes the original 5 accounts didn't use more than 30%.
That's stupid, it's overselling and it's not what you just described.
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| Posted by GreatDaneOwner, 06-18-2004, 05:39 PM | | Certainly not true. If your reseller host oversells, then you might be in for a bumpy ride. If they allow you to oversell, you're in for a much smoother ride, in fact.
In your case, it makes little or no difference, though, as you're not planning to offer hosting to others.
But if you think about it a little bit (and read up on it on these forums), you'll realize that practically all service providers oversell, and not only do they survive, but in fact this is their only option to make a profit. Think of any utility company. What would happen if everybody started running hot water at the same time? If we all switched on all the electronic equipment in the house? Services would stop, obviously. But in hosting, it's not that bad. If you oversell and reach your upper limit, you simply upgrade to a higher plan.
GDO
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| Posted by ldcdc, 06-18-2004, 07:34 PM | | And the reasoning behind that is?
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| Posted by chaud, 06-18-2004, 08:46 PM | | If they oversell, and you are with them, then if they use too many reasources and get suspeneded, so do you.
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| Posted by CrazyTech, 06-18-2004, 11:18 PM | | Before I start, I don't use overselling in my business tactics, but here is the real truth about overselling.
Overselling done the right way is certainly not a bad thing - in fact it's quite the opposite. There are many companies around that do a great job when it comes to overselling. If you properly monitor resources things will work out well and prices are lowered.
However, you have the bad apples giving the whole process a bad name. These people oversell in an extreme manner which does lead to those overworked servers and account cutoffs we hear all too much about. These types cram the server full without any sort of strategy and offer rock bottom costs. The best way to spot a bad reseller IMHO is to look for very, very low costs. Often a good overseller will have decent costs versus an extreme case where they may charge incredible costs.
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| Posted by Bashar, 06-19-2004, 12:37 AM | | overselling is nice at start, but with time you'll end losing most of your customers since your server resources will be consumed.
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| Posted by GreatDaneOwner, 06-19-2004, 02:19 AM | | You know the answer. You have to pay for actual resource usage only. As simple as that.
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| Posted by GreatDaneOwner, 06-19-2004, 02:22 AM | | This is true only for reseller hosts. If you're a reseller (and this is the Resellers forum, right?), you can always upgrade, as I said before.
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| Posted by twastudios, 06-19-2004, 02:30 AM | | Well put. My sentiments exactly.
There are limits to everything and promoting overselling on this forum is like throwing water on Greek fire, it's never going to go out that way.
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| Posted by GreatDaneOwner, 06-19-2004, 02:40 AM | | Did you read what I wrote in reply to what you're quoting? Of course there are limits to everything but as a reseller, you can upgrade your package when you need to. What's wrong with that?
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| Posted by Aussie Bob, 06-19-2004, 02:47 AM | | Not true, imo.
If a reseller provider allows resellers the ability to oversell, then the server is open to much_more_risk, than not allowing a reseller to oversell. That's been my experience from managing 28 reseller servers, and I've seen firsthand what resellers can do to a server, by having the ability to oversell.
Can't remember who said it, but they said, "overselling is the devil". I would have to agree with that, from my experience.
HasGreatDane, I believe you'd change your view, if you were basing your opinion from the standpoint of a reseller provider, and you have a dozen or more servers with resellers with the ability to oversell. That'd change your tune pretty quick smart.
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| Posted by twastudios, 06-19-2004, 02:49 AM | | There is nothing wrong with that statement, however, the thread starter wanted to know the pro/cons of overselling. Your are obviously pro and I am obviously con. There is nothing wrong with upgrading your account but I would disagree the promotion of overselling in these forums where new hosters are attempting to learn the business. Yes, overselling can be done wisely, but the last time I checked, no one discussing overselling around here, besides you, had much to say in the way of a positive business tactic.
Therefore, we will have to agree to disagree
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| Posted by GreatDaneOwner, 06-19-2004, 02:55 AM | | Agreed
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| Posted by okok, 06-19-2004, 02:56 AM | | In response to my inquiry, the host that permits overselling said they allow users to oversell, but charge them for the additional resources they need when they reach their limits.
Do you still think this is a dangerous policy? Their uptime record has been very good and their servers are fast. Doesn't this mean they manage to handle overselling responsibly? Would you still advice me to choose a hosting company that doesn't allow overselling (as I don't intend to do such things myself )?
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| Posted by twastudios, 06-19-2004, 03:00 AM | | There you go again, opening a whole can of worms j/k
IMHO.....I would not sign up for long if you intend to go with them. They may manage there servers well but I cannot evaluate that 100% accurately as I do not know how THEY are.
If they promote overselling, then there is trouble to be found and I would advise against it. Again, just my opinion.
Cheers.
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| Posted by GreatDaneOwner, 06-19-2004, 03:07 AM | | But I'm not a reseller provider and you know that . You can't fault someone for basing their opinion on their own experiences - and you can't say that experiences gained in another field are more valid .
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| Posted by Aussie Bob, 06-19-2004, 03:27 AM | | Exactly. I'm just stating that I'd think you'd change your opinion on this matter, if you were on the other side of the server/s.
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| Posted by NexDog, 06-19-2004, 04:17 AM | | I don't see a problem with overselling.
Plesk has never allowed overselling yet we have resellers with over a hundred domains. To get around the no overselling, they set space and transfer limits to zero but I'm sure they explain to their clients that their is a limit.
Why would a server suffer because overselling is enabled? Resellers oversell and their clients use lots of space and transfer so they just upgrade to the next plan. If you didn't allow overselling, resellers would set space and transfer to zero like they do on Plesk and you'd still have the same amount of domains. So it's not like you're helping the server by not enabling overselling.
I wish Plesk would add overselling - because it would just make things neater for resellers. It's a good tool that enables them to expand. They expand and upgrade to the next plan - everyone's a winner. We have it enabled on the ResellerNexus cPanel servers without any issues and if Plesk released a version with overselling, I'd enabled it on the HostNexus line too.
From my experience of running many resellers without overselling support and seeing how most larger resellers get around it, I can tell you it makes no difference to server performance.
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| Posted by The3bl, 06-19-2004, 04:19 AM | | There has to be a limit some where. If you have accounts that offer unlimited domains and overselling allowed I promise you there will be a guy that comes along and sticks 1000 domains on the server and oversells by 1000%.
Ask yourself if you really want your accounts on that server with him.
overselling done sensable can be a good thing and everyone makes money done open ended with no limits and somewhere sometime someone is going to pay the piper.
I see unlimited domains with unlimited overselling no different than a host selling unlimted disk space and transfer it is a marketing gimic and will cause problems later down the line for all concerned.
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| Posted by sharpnose, 06-19-2004, 04:22 AM | | It is quite evident from the previous threads that overselling is not advisable.
But if you search for the Reseller offers in Google------ you will find several offers ........ like ...........
e.g. 1GB - unlimited domains- 30GB monthly transfer --
$15.00-$20.00/mo
------Isn't that absurd?
Bcoz In a server with 80GB HDD: 80X30=2400GB bandwidth,
the cost of this server the reseller cannot afford while charging $15.00/mo from anyone.
Aren't they overselling?
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| Posted by NexDog, 06-19-2004, 04:32 AM | | That is the danger and it will happen. Though I advocate overselling, on our service each plan has a domain limit. That's just common sense.
Exactly! Overselling with a domain limit is an excellent way for your resellers to grow and gives them particular freedom to grow fast. This is good for everyone. They either upgrade to the next plan or go dedicated.
This is very true and we have seen it with the way resellers circumvent no reselling on Plesk. We don't allow reselling on Plesk but I've seen accounts with 200 domains in them and I can see from looking at said host's plans that the overselling rate is anything up to 2000%.
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| Posted by The3bl, 06-19-2004, 04:36 AM | | sharpnose
Sure they are, many do it. Does not make it right are smart, but they do it.
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| Posted by The3bl, 06-19-2004, 04:43 AM | | NexDog
There has to be a limit somewhere. We limit the oversell on our accounts and allow the customers to set up as many accounts as they want. in their alloted space and bandwidth, you limt the number of accounts but allow them to oversell space and bandwidth.
The real issue to me is those that allow oversell with no limits on either.
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| Posted by NexDog, 06-19-2004, 04:50 AM | | Have to agree there.
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| Posted by Aussie Bob, 06-19-2004, 06:07 AM | | Yep, same at HTTPme. It's not a perfect solution, but none the less, it's an acceptable compromise.
Yep, gotta say that one of the better decisions made at HTTPme, was placing domain number limits on new accounts. That shielded us (and our clients) from the resellers looking to cram many hundreds of domains in a $35/mth reseller account. So from then on, if you wanted to host hundreds of domains, it will rightly so cost you more, and you might think about having your own server.
The reseller supply model has got to be one of the most volatile sections of the hosting market place. You have your servers, and each server comprises of other hosts, all with their differing plans etc, and that can cause a lot of problems.
Fortunately HTTPme was only ~25% pure reseller, as most clients (web developers etc) just wanted to bundle their own domains (and maybe a few domains for their mates) under 1 account, and not have to pay for each separate domain hosted etc.
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| Posted by ldcdc, 06-19-2004, 09:19 AM | | Exactly the way I see it and it was the reason why I asked HasGreatDane for his reasoning when it comes to overselling.
If the resellers are allowed to oversell then the server is (basically) oversold. What's dangerous is that without a limit to overselling (unlimited domains), things can go really wild.
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| Posted by GreatDaneOwner, 06-19-2004, 09:31 AM | | This is only true if your reseller provider oversells.
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| Posted by Aussie Bob, 06-19-2004, 09:52 AM | | No offence but that's totally untrue. Overselling from the reseller level can cause a server to be technically "oversold", not that that's a bad thing, so long as it's carefully managed.
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| Posted by GreatDaneOwner, 06-19-2004, 10:04 AM | | Sorry, Bob, I don't get it. Could you explain it?
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| Posted by InSite, 06-19-2004, 10:17 AM | | I disagree here - the server is only compromised if the reseller provider is overselling, as this is putting everyone at risk. But allowing the resellers themselves to oversell cannot effect the server as a whole, as when each reseller reaches their 'actual' limits, they will need to purchase more physical space, either on this or a new server. Thus, the responsibility is on the reseller themselves to sell realistic plans, at realistic costs (in accordance with their upgrade fees).
However, what I can see being a problem is reseller providers thinking they arent overselling just because they offer out less than their dedicated server comes with. For example, I wouldnt like to be on a server pushing out anywhere near it's alloted 1000 GB data transfer. Allowing all resellers to oversell might mean that even though the server is within it's specified limits, more sites will be crammed onto it, as more accounts can be created and sold by more resellers.
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| Posted by Aussie Bob, 06-19-2004, 10:56 AM | | Sorry guys, I'm not in the mood for a 10 page thread on the complexities of allowing resellers to oversell (from the standpoint of a reseller or a reseller supplier), and the impact that can have on a server. I'll leave that to the other chaps in this thread. If any of you are reseller suppliers, then you'll either know now, or you'll know down the track that "overselling is the devil".
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| Posted by InSite, 06-19-2004, 11:07 AM | | Bob - I know you don't believe that, as you've already said that overselling is not "a bad thing, so long as it's carefully managed". Now we all know that most US dedicated server companies oversell, and we all know that a lot of reseller hosting companies oversell, and both can lead to very serious problems that will adversely effect every customer / site on the server.
But let's not try and suggest that enabling a reseller to oversell will effect anyone other than that one reseller, as it wont. They are capped in their usage, and once they exceed that cap they have to purchase more resources, either on the same server, or on a different one (or be suspended). If a reseller is irresponsible, then they can land themselves in a lot of trouble - but the server admin (reseller hosts), and all the other customers on the server, will not be touched by this.
Overselling is not the devil - stupidity and poor management is.
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| Posted by Aussie Bob, 06-19-2004, 11:26 AM | | I was being tongue in cheek, hence the " "
Of course anyone on a server can have an effect of anyone else on the server. It's a shared platform and they are all connected, whether they like it or not.
Yes it will.
Not if you're using WHM and allow resellers to oversell. They can setup hundreds of accounts and promise each account they setup, as much disk space and bandwidth as they like. That's called being able to oversell, as a reseller.
How many pure reseller servers do you manage?
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| Posted by The3bl, 06-19-2004, 11:41 AM | | How do you guys get that resellers overselling only affect themselves?
If some guy comes along and sells 500 domains, 200 gig of space and 2000 gig of transfer how much do you thiink is left for the other 25 resellers to sell?
It is a shared platform what one guy does can effect everyone else on that server.
I had one client I forgot to check the box to limit his space and bandwidith, next thing I knew he had sold 3000 gig of transfer and 120 gig of space. Now he was not using it all for sure but if those accounts over months had grown and been allowed to continue we could have all been in deep trouble.
Unless your reseller account is isolated what one does can and will over time effect everyone on the server. Easy to say it is no big deal when a server is new but as time goes on accounts grow and consume more and more resources and no where is that more evident than on a reseller server that is a year old.
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| Posted by InSite, 06-19-2004, 12:01 PM | | Make up your mind...
We are talking about a reseller overselling his own space and bandwidth, which is capped by the reseller host. We arent talking about how a site can affect the performance of a server within a shared environment - that is something completely different.
Explain how this can happen. Someone purchases a 1 / 20 GB reseller plan from 'bobshosting', and has overselling enabled. He then sells 1 / 20 GB plans to 20 customers. How will this effect anyone other than this one reseller, and his own customers when things go tits up? When things go wrong, the reseller will be forced to either give up his business, or purchase more space - at which point the reseller provider can give this to him, or move him to a new server.
What a reseller promises to his customers, and what he is allowed to deliver in accordance with what he has purchased, can be two entirely different things. We are talking about actual usage. The reseller can 'promise' as much space as they like, but it will be the resellers responsibility to deliver this - once he uses up his actual resources, he has to sort something out.
Could you repeat the question please - I had my "patronising filter" enabled And anyway, wouldnt the more relevant question be whether or not I enable overselling on my servers?
As much space and bandwidth as they have purchased from their reseller host, with the option for growth of course. If someone is stupid enough to offer 50 gig plans, then he wont be able to deliver this, but overselling hasnt caused the problem, stupidity has.
This is not an argument for or against overselling, and is irrelivant here.
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| Posted by Andrew, 06-19-2004, 12:15 PM | | InSite, you are arguing with experts in this field. Both of them are absolutely correct.
Nobody should really even bother answering these questions of yours, because they're just so silly.
Explain how it can affect others on the server? A reseller account completely unfettered with overselling enabled? When someone asks that kind of ridiculous question, it makes one return to one of Bob's questions that you neglected to answer:
Just how many pure reseller servers DO you manage?
If you need to know why that is relevant, it is because your questions and statements indicate a lack of experience.
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| Posted by InSite, 06-19-2004, 12:41 PM | | The point I am arguing here is that overselling is not as bad as everyone makes out - it's just that it's been done so badly by some people in the past. Hell, even HTTPME admitted to overselling their first duel xeon processor, due to a lack of experience in knowing how many accounts it could handle. This implies that at the time, they were adding accounts to a server based on actual usage, rather than what had been purchased from them (overselling).
In some ways, you can liken overselling to taking pre-sales. So long as you have the infrastructure available to provide what you are selling at any given time, then what is the problem? It only becomes impossible when people promise the earth, and have no feasable way of delivering it.
Either way, if the reseller host assumes that what people purchase from them will one day be used to it's full potential, then there shouldnt be a problem. Yes, a reseller with overselling enabled can fit more accounts into their plan than they could otherwise, but they are still limited to what they have purchased. What is the problem with that?
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| Posted by Aussie Bob, 06-19-2004, 12:46 PM | | Sure, "How many pure reseller servers do you manage?"
I'm not being patronising. I'm just trying to see if you walk the talk.
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| Posted by Aussie Bob, 06-19-2004, 12:54 PM | | We just struck a patch of heavy resellers on that server, and some heavy sites that should have never gone to a shared platform. It's a very volatile platform, so flexibility is the key. We wouldn't add new accounts to existing servers, and just let the natural churn and account growth find a balance. Sometimes you have to lighten up a server, or move folks to a dedicated server etc. It's just the nature of the business model.
But allowing resellers to oversell, and have unlimited domains, is greatly increasing the server's chances of instabilty.
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| Posted by espinja, 06-19-2004, 01:01 PM | | Small-time hosting providers "oversell."
Enterprise hosting providers, on the other hand, manage capacity and performance, resource utilization, resource allocation, etc. That's not overselling. That's systems management, and demand-driven infrastructure.
There's a big difference between those two points of view.
Joe E.
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| Posted by twastudios, 06-19-2004, 01:53 PM | | Wow, this thread really took off
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| Posted by ldcdc, 06-19-2004, 08:42 PM | | InSite, AussieBob actually used the business model that he's so fervently criticising. He knows from his experience that at some point, following that business model, serious trouble lies ahead.
What is the difference between you directly putting 2000 websites with 20,000GB of total alocated bandwidth on a single server and your 20 or 50 resellers hosted on the box doing that same thing?
There's no difference! It's massive overselling and it can and will eventually lead to problems. And before you think about moving resellers to new boxes, remember that moving websites and/or reseller accounts from server to server should be the exception, not the rule. With 2000 websites on a box (yes, given the opportunity the resellers will push things to the max), moving websites around will become a habbit, unless you're OK with server loads of 20 or so.
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| Posted by Aussie Bob, 06-19-2004, 09:38 PM | | I wouldn't say I was "fervently criticising" (although I do like the passion that exudes ). Allowing resellers to oversell will open up the server to greater risk, but IMO, it's still a manageable risk, and one that we worked with to good success.
I would have personally loved to see overselling gone (tried it once ) but as NexDog pointed out, there are ways that resellers could get around not being able to oversell anyways. I haven't been in WHM for months now, so I'm not sure if things are still pretty much the same as far as reseller control etc.
I know we could never cap a Reseller account by real usage, with keeping overselling enabled. That's not a great feature for a reseller client, that if they go over their usage for all their domains combined, does the system suspend all their domains? I just used to manually check each reseller's account usage, and make sure they're not using more resources than their plan allows.
Flexibility is the name of the game here. Shared hosting is an imperfect beast as it is, and the Reseller's being able to oversell, just ups the risk factor a few times. But it's still manageable, but you have to be on the ball.
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| Posted by espinja, 06-19-2004, 09:41 PM | | Okay, never mind my post, above.
It seems as though this conversation is specifically concerning "single-box" resellers who rent one server, and then piecemeal the resources to downstream customers.
I'll assume the issue of overselling isn't about the larger datacenter type operations, based on the messages above.
I apologize for jumping in before reading more carefully...
Joe E.
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| Posted by AussieHosts, 06-19-2004, 09:54 PM | | http://www.webhostingtalk.com/showth...l&pagenumber=3
There are two types of overselling. The type you see the poor results of fairly quickly, loading up a server with too many sites, and the type that will creep up and bite you on the backside.
Years ago many pre-sales queries included "how many sites per server". The whole "reseller" thing has pushed that under the carpet. But it'll be back.
Gary
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| Posted by InSite, 06-19-2004, 09:56 PM | | The major difference is that if it is the reseller host carrying out the overselling, then everyone on the server is in trouble, as it is very difficult for admins to restrict usage and resources on the server to safe levels; whereas if it is a reseller account overselling, then their accounts on the server are still restricted by real usage limitations, and can be controlled.
With overselling disabled, you can sell a 5 GB reseller plan, knowing full well that it is extremely difficult for that 5 GB plan to ever be fully used (it's unlikely that every resold account will be used to it's full potential). However this makes it safer for the reseller host to 'oversell', placing more accounts onto a server based on account and resource usage. And as Bob posted above, you can get caught out with this when resellers do actually use their resources.
So yes, there are good reasons for a host not to enable overselling - it is more likely that each reseller will use up their full quota of resources, meaning the server will be busier, and generate less income because fewer reseller accounts can be fitted onto a single server. It is also a good way to protect your customer from creating unrealistic plans, and landing themselves in trouble when they can't fulfill their customers needs. But overselling is not an evil in the industry - used to good effect, and managed properly, it has helped move things forward.
(BTW - some people here seem to either be taking this discussion too personally, or using it as an excuse to cast doubt on the abilities / knowledge of others. This is a theoretical discussion, no need to get so aggressive over it guys )
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| Posted by espinja, 06-19-2004, 09:58 PM | | On another note...
I run SQL clusters, and front-end them with multiple web/app servers.
What about the rest of us? Do you manage a server farm, or do you have just one server? And, no, that doesn't mean 20 servers running as 20 individual servers. I mean hardware-independent clusters, no single point of hardware failure, snapshots and backups, systems monitoring/management, etc.
If you do use one box for everything, what are your reasons for doing so?
What criteria do you consider before adding more servers/resources?
I'm just curious, because I'm probably way too paranoid. Of course, I'll bet some of us are way too relaxed. Perhaps comparing notes on our own infrastructure could save each of us some money, or help each of us avoid a disaster.
I'm not talking about a "battle of the brains" slugfest, arguing about whose infrastructure is best. Just simple explanation of our stuff, with our reasons for choosing our systems.
I'd be happy to collect, extrapolate, and re-publish the data as a useful document for us all. A cookbook, if you will... No names, just accurate, generic information. PM me, if you're interested. It would be interesting to put together.
Joe E.
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| Posted by Aussie Bob, 06-20-2004, 04:18 AM | | Ahah! I knew someone said that. I'm not completely senile . . .
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| Posted by senaia, 06-20-2004, 02:49 PM | | I have been reading every word in this thread and this what I came to understand:
Overselling is bad BUT we always need to take risks when doing business, other wise we would be wasting our time for a few hundred bucks a month.
If the reseller provider and the reseller OVERSELL, then server will be over-loaded.
Because the provider will oversell the reseller and the reseller will oversell the clients and every thing will go wild and out of control.
If the reseller provider do not oversell but allow the reseller to oversell. Then the reseller can simply upgrade when he reachs his limits. But you wont be the only reseller on the server whois overselling. so the server will be overloaded and crowded to its LIMITS and were back to where we started.
So overselling is good at the beginning to make a quick cash, but with time it will become worst nightmare.
I know im not an expert in this field but I hope I understood this issue right (Do Not Oversell).
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| Posted by whmcsguru, 06-20-2004, 06:11 PM | | For a reseller, overselling is not a good thing. Granted, most clients won't ever use but 1/3 of the actual disk space, bandwidth and the like, but they still get used, but the problem isn't that, it's accounting. How do you do the math and calculate monthly totals? It'd be kind of hard to do that if you ask me.
Also, as Bob mentioned, there's got to be a bit of knowledge there. For example, if I oversell my own bandwidth and my own server (drive, etc), I can keep it reasonably well under control (ie: don't oversell more than 30%, that kind of thing). However, if you have 5 resellers on the same server doing the same thing, server resources will get out of hand extremely quickly. Nobody's going to talk to one another and keep them updated on what they resold, what they didn't, etc
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| Posted by grace5, 06-21-2004, 03:31 PM | | Overselling is bad, is a half truth.
Its kinda like saying: Alcohol is bad.
But that only applies to those that have a problem with it (abuse it) . It is still used as a medication to alot of people around the world.
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| Posted by FutureHive, 07-26-2004, 05:14 AM | | When properly monitored overselling, in my oppinion, can be helpful to help distribute resources to those who need them, as opposed to those who don't.
When overselling, and almost everything else, you can earn a lot from simply knowing who your client base is and deciding their needs beforehand, then you should be able to judge how many cars to put on the road before a traffic jam occurs.
Overselling is a risk, but that risk is lowered if it's managed properly, and isn't oversold to an extreme amount.
Interesting thread
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| Posted by pmabraham, 07-26-2004, 06:33 AM | | Greetings:
The largest catch with those trying to oversell responsibly is that very few go beyond figuring out 50% of the formula.
They determine how many sites they can cram onto a server on a server by server basis, but rarely calculate the critical mass they must maintain in order for that formula to work effectively every time.
Therefore turning the entire event from being responsible to outright gambling.
Thank you.
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| Posted by Shaw Networks, 07-26-2004, 11:37 AM | | If you will be just using the accounts for your own use, you won't need overselling. Overselling allows you to distribute out more space/bandwidth than your reseller account has been assigned by your provider.
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| Posted by FutureHive, 07-26-2004, 12:02 PM | | That's the basic answer to the initial question, however, what most other users are trying to point out are the 'knock on' effects of allowing other (virtually seperate) users to oversell their space as well, which can influence the performance of the server in a detrimental way.
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